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Here are some quotes from "Women and Their Fathers - the sexual and romantic impact of the first man in your life", by Victoria Secunda, UK paperback publisher Cedar Books 1993 ISBN 0 7493 1500 8. I found this a fascinating book. amazon.com has the Delta paperback ISBN 0385310234 here.
At the bottom of this page, I have links to other books concerning fathers and daughters, and to Victoria Secunda's other books. Please note that she is writing about fathers, not about spanking. The quotes here are © Victoria Secunda and are reproduced here without authorisaion, in the spirit of review and fair use. Commentary © Mr Fondman 1999 to 2000. Let me know if you would like to quote from this or if you can suggest any improvements.
First an overview of the book, then a quote on the distinction between authoritative and authoritarian (domineering) fathers, then my discussion of how this relates to a man -> woman disciplinary situation. I have used asterisks to highlight what I believe are most important parts of the quote.
Victoria Secunda interviewed American 150 daughters and 75
fathers, and has built up a picture of the major types of father
or father-daughter relationship - and their consequences for how
the woman develops, in particular in respect of her loving
relationships with men.Chapters 4 to 9 describe her six classifications of father-
daughter relationship.
- The Good-Enough Father
- The Doting Father
- The Distant Father
- The Demanding Father
- The Seductive Father
- The Absent Father
The authoritative and authoritarian (domineering) fathers are the
two very different types of "Demanding" father.
Starting on page 147, the second page of the chapter on the
Demanding Father:
The Authoritative Father
Wendy, forty-five, recently suffered what is arguably the
worst loss a parent can experience - her twenty-one-year-old
son died of a rare form of cancer. All through his agonizing
illness Wendy drew on memories of her father, who died when
she was in college, for courage and fortitude. She says,Whenever I feel like falling apart, I would think of dad.This kind of father drags his children, sometimes kicking and
His strength was constant. When I was a kid, I was in an
automobile accident and the doctors said I'd be in a
wheelchair for life. My father said. "She will walk
again." He was so determined, so inspiring, that I did.
At times I resented him, because we were both stubborn.
But I adored him and he adored me. All the qualities
that have gotten me through the hard times I got from
him. I always have a voice in my head that says,
"You can do it. Press on."
screaming, into giving their personal best. For he has an eye
not simply on the moment, but on the future - he very much
wants to prepare them for survival and happiness in the adult
world, to see life as a series of challenging opportunities.To that end he is willing to be the family heavy if necessary;
he is seldom plagued by second thoughts and cannot be
bamboozled. He doesn't expect always to be liked, but since
he tempers his demands with affection, its hard to hate him.
For he is also able to express pride in his children's
accomplishments, to share their joy when they meet or exceed
his expectations or their own, to allow them to be who they
are - regardless of gender.And while at times he may seem stern, he is fair: The daughter
who loses a finals tennis match may, for that day, be relieved
of her chores; the son whose girlfriend breaks up with him
right before the exam will not be expected to pull a high
mark.* The consensus amongst experts is that the children of
* authoritative fathers (or mothers) have the fewest behavioural
* problems and self-doubts. They know they can depend on him;
* they know exactly where they stand; and even if Dad is not
* the Mickey Rooney of joviality, they can count on his love,
* supportiveness, and interest as well as his discipline, the
* blend of which gives them enormous security.* The rock-sure, loving authority has long-lasting beneficial
* effects on his daughters.* First, the daughter's cognitive abilities are enormously
* enhanced by a father who excites her curiosity, who stretches
* her limits by setting high - but not impossible - standards
* and who serves as mentor in her strivings outside the family.
* But he does not make the learning process easy. Rather than
* jumping in and solving his daughter's problems for her, he
* gently but firmly forces her to find solutions for herself
* and to profit from her mistakes.* Thus the daughter learns firsthand how to set priorities and
* goals in school and, later, on the job; how to defend her
* ideas; how to surmount obstacles - none of which is at the
* expense of her emotional side. Her father loves her whether
* or not she achieves, encouraging both her nurturing and
* mastering abilities, her empathy and her ambition. Just as
* he does his son's.* The second benefit to daughters of authoritative fathers is
* their robust sexuality. According to Dr Seymour Fisher,
* those women who are the most consistently orgasmic - 39
* percent of his research sample - almost always had fathers
* who were authoritative, fathers who prize "morality,
* honesty, and strictness in adhering to rules."The fathers in Fisher's study were not vague presences
within the family; rather they were actively involved
with their children. Their daughters had no anxieties
about the solidity and dependability of the relationship
- the keystone to their sexual responsiveness in their
adult romantic attachments.In all these ways the authoritative father - his inner
security, his unflagging interest, his warmth and fair,
gender-neutral expectations - inspired confidence, rather
than slavish self-doubt, in his daughter.The Domineering (authoritarian) Father
The same cannot be said of the domineering father. Indeed,
his authority is purchased at the expense of his children.
It is reactive rather than inherent, contingent on the
hoarding of power rather than the sharing of it. Instead
of guiding his children, he competes with them. At the
same time, to prevent their forming a united front, he
divides and conquers, arbitrarily playing favourites and
pitting them against one another.The obeisance of his family is as necessary to his sense of
self as is food for the body. And like physical hunger,
his psychic hunger requires constant nourishment.Yet his behaviour is a study in paradoxes.
On the one hand he views his children's failure to meet
his expectations as betrayals, since he wants them to
reflect well upon him, to herald the fact that he is
the wellspring of their accomplishments.On the other hand, he doesn't really want them to be so
successful, so confident, that they pose a threat to his
rank and command. Hence, the messages he gives can be very
mixed, keeping his children hobbled and off balance.Especially his daughters, as we shall see.
Domineering fathers come in guises of increasing harshness -
from obdurate to cruel - which often overlap, including:
- The controller
- The tyrant
- The bully
In pages 150 to 168, she explores the domineering fathers in
detail. Here are two brief quotes:Page 155, as part of a discussion of The Tyrannized Family:
As we shall see, this sense of impotence stems from the
domineering father's own childhood. He tends to have been
rigidly disciplined, humiliated, or beaten by his own father,
and repeats with his wife and children the behavior he
learned early in life.The Dominated Wife
Such men are often drawn to women who were similarly
maltreated, women who may share their violent streak -
towards the children at least - and who behave towards their
husbands as they once did towards their own fathers,
desperately trying to placate them.
On page 156, she writes of the factors in the culture of the USA
which she believes encourage and cause domineering fathers.
The Roots of Paternal Domination
The domineering father is a role for which men in this
culture traditionally have been trained - and in fact after
distant fathers, this is the most prevalent paternal style
I encountered.Given this country's macho values and forbidding, Puritan
origins, patriarchal wrath is as American as apple pie.
Indeed, when compared with other Western cultures, ours
is unusually violent.
(End of quotes from Women and their Fathers.)
I believe that the "authoritative" style described above,
translates directly into the most healthy approach a man could
take when providing a disciplinary framework for his beloved
woman. This doesn't mean he would always be in this
"authoritative" mode. He needs to relax, be a loving partner, and
there will be many times when he needs to be cared for by his
woman.The key point is the long-term - very long term - goals he has for
the woman (or children) in his care.This kind of man does not necessarily take any direct short-term
pleasure from being authoritative or from the actions of imposing
discipline and administering punishment. Perhaps he does appreciate
a well-spanked bottom, but that is not the reason he punishes the
woman he loves.Note that there is no suggestion that the authoritative father
desires his daughter to be in any way "submissive". While he
expects her to comply with his carefully chosen rules, the purpose
of the rules is to foster her independence, confidence and
strength.The authoritarian, domineering father does want a submissive
daughter. He takes direct pleasure in his destructive actions,
and in the long-term degradation and disempowerment of the
children - and probably his wife.
I don't seek a submissive woman. I would like to be with a woman
who enjoyed play and therapeutic spanking, but it would be best if
her conduct was such that there was little if any need for
corrective action. In my experience, some of the most intelligent,
energetic, feminine women do have some disciplinary needs, so I
am prepared to do the work to make the most of the situation.
While I would take pride in a well-spanked bottom, or in a very
effective lecture as she stands with her nose in the corner, or in a
fiendishly composed paragraph for her to write two dozen copies
of - but punishing a loved one, in my limited experience, is a lonely,
demanding and unpleasant process which I would like to minimise.
According to a review at Amazon.com of Losing Your Parents, Finding Your Self (see below):"Victoria Secunda is a journalist, lecturer, [Amazon has a missing word or two here] the author of several award-winning books, including When You and Your Mother Can't Be Friends. Her articles have appeared in major publications, and she has been a frequent guest on Oprah and the Today Show, as well as numerous other television and radio programs here and abroad. She lives in Ridgefield, Connecticut."
I haven't read these books, but they may be of interest. I enjoy looking at the Amazon listings for the customer reviews and links to related books.